That's a good point too! I agree, I don't mean that it's so simple as coming down to a conscious decision or a clear understanding of your own motivations, especially at that age. Like, I think there's an implication that the Hat can see the truth of your heart and motivations beyond what your 11-year-old mind can feel - that's why he's basically narrating Harry's innermost thoughts and desires to him during the Sorting.
And then you factor in the whole concept of 'our choices make us who we are', and that Harry's desperate wish not to be in Slytherin was factored into the choice, and it's definitely a more complex issue. I think the way you act to the hat is also important; I remember someone saying once that Neville arguing mentally with the Hat over which house he'll go to is the most ridiculously Gryffindor thing ever, for example, because that takes a lot of balls that he didn't realise he had! So while I think that motivation, however unconsciously, is the key factor, your choices and actions and possibly an ineffable Magical Sense are also important considerations.
When it comes to Dumbledore, I think he thought he was doing the right thing, though. Remember the extracts we saw of his letters? Grindlewald had talked him into a 'for the muggles' own good' mindset, so it was based on genuine - if deeply fucked up - desire to do good. Hermione's speech basically epitomises what I mean, actually! Like she spends the whole book - and subsequent books after the speech - praising books and taking the smart route etc etc, but when it comes down to it even at age 11 she'll easily emotionally dismiss their importance in favor of the ultimate motivation of heroism and righteousness.
Dumbledore's comment about 'maybe we sort too early' and Peter are interesting concepts, though. There must have been something that made Peter a Gryffindor. Did he idolise the concept of being a hero and genuinely want to be good and live up to his friends, but when the chips fell he just couldn't hack it and became a cowardly shell of his former self? To tie that back to FFXV, would that make Ardyn for example a Gryffindor despite the twisted, selfish villain he became?
Re: Harry Potter AU
That's a good point too! I agree, I don't mean that it's so simple as coming down to a conscious decision or a clear understanding of your own motivations, especially at that age. Like, I think there's an implication that the Hat can see the truth of your heart and motivations beyond what your 11-year-old mind can feel - that's why he's basically narrating Harry's innermost thoughts and desires to him during the Sorting.
And then you factor in the whole concept of 'our choices make us who we are', and that Harry's desperate wish not to be in Slytherin was factored into the choice, and it's definitely a more complex issue. I think the way you act to the hat is also important; I remember someone saying once that Neville arguing mentally with the Hat over which house he'll go to is the most ridiculously Gryffindor thing ever, for example, because that takes a lot of balls that he didn't realise he had! So while I think that motivation, however unconsciously, is the key factor, your choices and actions and possibly an ineffable Magical Sense are also important considerations.
When it comes to Dumbledore, I think he thought he was doing the right thing, though. Remember the extracts we saw of his letters? Grindlewald had talked him into a 'for the muggles' own good' mindset, so it was based on genuine - if deeply fucked up - desire to do good. Hermione's speech basically epitomises what I mean, actually! Like she spends the whole book - and subsequent books after the speech - praising books and taking the smart route etc etc, but when it comes down to it even at age 11 she'll easily emotionally dismiss their importance in favor of the ultimate motivation of heroism and righteousness.
Dumbledore's comment about 'maybe we sort too early' and Peter are interesting concepts, though. There must have been something that made Peter a Gryffindor. Did he idolise the concept of being a hero and genuinely want to be good and live up to his friends, but when the chips fell he just couldn't hack it and became a cowardly shell of his former self? To tie that back to FFXV, would that make Ardyn for example a Gryffindor despite the twisted, selfish villain he became?